Sneak Peek

[Strela]

David:

Many thanks! 

A map upgrade and available right out of the box has been a "dream" for many PzC gamers!

My eyes thank you VERY MUCH! 

It won't be just a map upgrade, there are larger counters and all the unit art is new as well. No more cartoon caricatures....

David

[BigDuke66]

I hope you won't simply switch all the games to that PB graphic set that did come with the latest patches for Moscow 42 & Kharkov 43.
The PB graphics seem OK for a tactical engine but in PC we are on an operational level that needs a good and easy recognizable map. Having X different versions of a village graphic may be fancy for PB but just confusing for an operational game. You can easily see it on the screenshots with Kharkov in the initial post, with the PB graphics you can't distinguish the terrain, the old stock graphics allow to differentiate clearly between city, town and village hexes just like the graphic set of Jison would allow.
That is why I like the map look more, Jison's MapMod was and is my favorite for the operational games of HPS/JTS, it not only looks better than the old stock art but also improves playability because everything is easier to recognize.

Will this be only an artwork updated or do the games get patched to use graphics with higher resolution like PB does?


@phoenix
You are not forced to use the hexborder graphics. I love Jison's MapMod as it improved the series a lot, but the terrain hex color and hardcoded hexborders are not good at all and these where the first things I replaced. If you need the files to do that just PM or mail me and I'll send them to you.

[Strela]

I hope you won't simply switch all the games to that PB graphic set that did come with the latest patches for Moscow 42 & Kharkov 43.
The PB graphics seem OK for a tactical engine but in PC we are on an operational level that needs a good and easy recognizable map. Having X different versions of a village graphic may be fancy for PB but just confusing for an operational game. You can easily see it on the screenshots with Kharkov in the initial post, with the PB graphics you can't distinguish the terrain, the old stock graphics allow to differentiate clearly between city, town and village hexes just like the graphic set of Jison would allow.
That is why I like the map look more, Jison's MapMod was and is my favorite for the operational games of HPS/JTS, it not only looks better than the old stock art but also improves playability because everything is easier to recognize.

Will this be only an artwork updated or do the games get patched to use graphics with higher resolution like PB does?


@phoenix
You are not forced to use the hexborder graphics. I love Jison's MapMod as it improved the series a lot, but the terrain hex color and hardcoded hexborders are not good at all and these where the first things I replaced. If you need the files to do that just PM or mail me and I'll send them to you.

Hi,

No these are all new for the whole series. I put the first shot in to show the 'old' vs the new. I thought I had stated that but it was obviously not clear. I think there is sufficient definition between village/towns/cities with the new version.

We're moving this series back to be more map like due to the scale as the PZB look is just wrong for an operational level game. Both Kharkov '43 and Moscow '42 will be upgraded at the same time. I'm actually making reasonable progress and am focused on the Eastern Front first and have 5 games converted.

The artwork uses the existing resolutions, which is sufficient currently.

I expect we will relaunch the series as 'extended' or 'complete' versions and existing (JTS) owners will be able to upgrade vs patch and new buyers will get the new package.


David

[Strela]

Looks superb, David. Much more map-like. But - and this is a HUGE 'but' for me - in the 2d screens, are those hexes - those Jison type hexes (where there is no way you can get rid of the hex edges, because they are part of the hex itself, not a contour marking and not a hex edge) - going to be part of it? because I absolutely hate them. They are the reason I won't buy the WW1 titles - because you can't now get rid of the damn hexes (at least, not without some graphics modding). Why do they have to be there? They are most definitely NOT map-like or natural. I understand some people like their hexes, but others hate them - so why not leave them optional, as they are at present? The graphics are really important for me, for immersion, and if I thought I couldn't get rid of these hexes I wouldn't buy. Seriously.

If they are to be there, then can you at least say that the relevant parts of the 'map' folder (the 25, 50, and 100normal, mud, snow files etc) will at least be the same size and format as the current ones, so that I can swap the files out and get rid of the hexes?

Peter

Ok Peter/All,

I'm now home and doing some experiments. Personally I like the light hex but I will consider including a non-hex version. This is more hassle than I thought as I don't have the master for snow or mud that I can find so I will have to try and remember what I did to get them.

For  comparison here is the current version of the terrain with the embedded hexes - (please note all images can be viewed full size by right clicking and viewing in a separate tab)





Here is an identical shot with the hexes removed. You will see a 'starburst' in every hex. This is a technique that Jison used in mapmod that I emulated. It is pretty obvious when there is no hex included. It's not so obvious when the hexside is shown;





Here is a final version without the starburst. You can't see the individual hexes but the terrain looks much flatter;





If you have a preference please let me know.

David

[BigDuke66]

Last screenshot shows the best result in my opinion.

Will the color range be the same as Jison did?
Besides the embedded hexborders I also didn't use that part of his graphics because the color ranged from deep blue to purple, that didn't look like a map at all to me. I like the old school green to brown range better.

[Strela]

Last screenshot shows the best result in my opinion.

Will the color range be the same as Jison did?
Besides the embedded hexborders I also didn't use that part of his graphics because the color ranged from deep blue to purple, that didn't look like a map at all to me. I like the old school green to brown range better.

The colour range I'm using comes from one of the 'defaults' on a popular cartography site.

Here are the base values....




David

[phoenix]

+1 on that, David. The last one (though the middle one is a massive improvement on the first). Thanks for asking!

I will also mod the hex edge files and colour out the hex edges, which (to me) make mere contours look like cliffs. I can go with a 'true' map look and only normal optional contours quite happily. If the colour scheme is nice then mostly I don't even need the contours either to be able to see the gradients sufficient to play.

Would love any files you have, BigDuke66 which use the Jison graphics for the JTS VERSIONS of the games (I haven't any HPS versions and the graphics files are a different size between the HPS and JTS versions). At the moment I use a real mish-mash of mods. I use Jison's beautiful unit portraits. I mostly use the Devine symbols. I use the the Jison features files as modded very kindly by Strela, I believe, so that they work with the JTS versions. And with several of the features I've also tampered with the files myself.

I think David's new features, as posted above, are the very best I've seen. Really great, map-like and clear.

I'll PM you, BigDuke66.

Peter

You want me to test the new graphics, David? Would love to. I have Kharkov 42, 43, Smolensk, Mius, Kursk 43. Would love, in particular to try Kursk 43 with the new features and colour scheme (though without embedded hexes and edges!). For me that is the most cluttered and unclear map of all, in need of a nice rational overhaul. One of my objections to the hex edges and non-optional hexes is that in maps like Kursk, which are, I would say, very busy maps, there is just too much there to be able to read it easily if the hexes and the hex edges are on.

I see there's been some nice work too on rivers, streams (and possibly roads) to make them more natural looking!

[Kool Kat]

We're looking at replacing all the artwork across the current twenty one games that have been published. This is definitely not a task for the faint-hearted and is something we have been doing in our spare time while working on further Panzer Battle titles. This is not just a graphics upgrade but will also include Ed Williams Volcano mods alternate scenarios - so it's more of a relaunch of the series. Please note this is only for the JTS versions, though the unit images are interchangeable.

 
The current JTS versions of Panzer Campaigns use an early version of the 'small sized' Panzer Battles graphics. They were not at all to scale and the 'realistic' look didn't quite work.
 
As mentioned this is to cover all twenty one games that have been released and we would like to upgrade them all at the same time to ensure consistency. So please don't ask when it will be ready but it is moving along nicely.
 
 
David

Hey David:  

I understand the need to ensure consistency with all 21 PzC game titles. Got it. 

However, please note that my future PzC game purchases are on "hold" until you and Team complete the artwork + mod alt scenarios update project. 

I just can't work with the "out-of-box" graphics... and with the Map Mod Website offline (permanently)... there are no options for upgrading the vanilla PzC graphics. 

Hope your conversion project proceeds in a timely manner... and please let us players know when you complete this much anticipated and exciting project!   

It should revitalize the PzC Series and eliminate the "I can't stand the graphics" excuse from potential buyers. 

Again, a BIG THANKS for undergoing this much needed "upgrade." 

[BigDuke66]

Is the Map Mod Website really permanently offline?

[Mr Grumpy]

Yes.