Opfire in 1.04

[Jason Petho]

While there is some truth in what you're saying Jason regarding the Falaise Pocket closure, Ed's example is about 6-12 soldiers (i.e. 1-2 SPs out of a 6SP German platoon) out in the open resisting multiple strong attacks. Not a mixed force of armor, SP AT guns and infantry in an urban area.

Yes Mike, I understand.

Merely stating that the mixed force in an urban area, defending, would hold out longer than a turn or two.

One can find examples that work in both directions.

The last East Front scenario I played using the 1.04 rules; a disrupted russian motorcycle platoon, in a bunker, in the open along a road was successfully assaulted and captured by a lone infantry platoon.

Jason Petho

[Adolf Vahringer]

I don't get into the "nuts and bolts" of the game but I have played a few and it just seems to me that the opfire has become a little bit more effective than before, and it has not been cyclical.

I have watched replays where my opfire has caused most all of my opponents units to retreat, even at max range.

Gavin

[Herr Straße Laufer]

Merely stating that the mixed force in an urban area, defending, would hold out longer than a turn or two.

One can find examples that work in both directions.

The last East Front scenario I played using the 1.04 rules; a disrupted russian motorcycle platoon, in a bunker, in the open along a road was successfully assaulted and captured by a lone infantry platoon.

Jason Petho

Hi Jason,

I would have preferred you to address my example instead of bringing out one of your own. I have no problem with units holding out in urban areas, built up areas of any type, or in bunkers.

My situation was an example of a lone platoon of motorcycle infantry holding out in the open while under artillery fire, direct infantry fire, and coming under multiple attacks from multiple hexes, while the unit was disrupted and losing strength points. Not only was it out of supply, all HQ's were destroyed and the unit was surrounded.
Three turns is only 18 minutes. But, every other assault is supposed to work in that circumstance. Most do. Most should?
Even Soviet Atr platoons are now impervious to assault and more so when they are "hidden".

I honestly think that something needs to be toned down in the defender values or assault values increased in the attacking armor. And, in case it crosses anyone's mind, the assaults against the surrounded desert motorcycle platoon had infantry mixed into every assault.

But, this is an opt fire discussion and I am still finding that it is too potent.

RR

[Herr Straße Laufer]

I don't get into the "nuts and bolts" of the game but I have played a few and it just seems to me that the opfire has become a little bit more effective than before, and it has not been cyclical.

I have watched replays where my opfire has caused most all of my opponents units to retreat, even at max range.

Gavin

Retreats, disrupts, SP losses all go far to effect the game. At range they have an even greater impact.
I've seen all happen on a regular basis since the download of 1.04. Very few no effects from any opt fire. Very effective longer range shots too!

RR

[Jason Petho]

I would have preferred you to address my example instead of bringing out one of your own.

If you find squirrly happenings during your turns, feel free to email them to me with your password so I can see. Just the .bte and password - scenarios files are necessary if you are not playing a stock scenario.

I have no problem keeping an ongoing spreadsheet of issues, but prefer files so I can see what is happening.

Jason Petho

[schnurbart]

I have played a lot of 104 and i can assure you that op fire is no different. everything depends on the combat results table times the strength points of a given shot. as far as extreme assualt goes..i will not use it for any pre 104 scenarios..its to fundamental a difference to warrant
use without either re design or new stuff played and tested under those conditions.

[Herr Straße Laufer]

I have played a lot of 104 and i can assure you that op fire is no different. everything depends on the combat results table times the strength points of a given shot. as far as extreme assualt goes..i will not use it for any pre 104 scenarios..its to fundamental a difference to warrant
use without either re design or new stuff played and tested under those conditions.

Sorry. Not my experience with op fire. I've watched my opponents and myself get smashed in each game played. I've played my share of 1.04.

Pre 1.04 scenarios. Which are the post 1.04 scenarios?
It's definately not those included in the "upgrade".

RR

[schnurbart]

I have played a lot of 104 and i can assure you that op fire is no different. everything depends on the combat results table times the strength points of a given shot. as far as extreme assualt goes..i will not use it for any pre 104 scenarios..its to fundamental a difference to warrant
use without either re design or new stuff played and tested under those conditions.

Sorry. Not my experience with op fire. I've watched my opponents and myself get smashed in each game played. I've played my share of 1.04.

Pre 1.04 scenarios. Which are the post 1.04 scenarios?
It's definately not those included in the "upgrade".

RR

Unless the ai has a new bug that rolls dice good there can be no difference unless the combat results table was changed. New scenarios suitable for extreme assault i'm sure will come.

[Herr Straße Laufer]

Unless the ai has a new bug that rolls dice good there can be no difference unless the combat results table was changed. New scenarios suitable for extreme assault i'm sure will come.

We've been told that the AI was not changed. A bug? Hmmm ... who knows?
Scenarios. I've gone back to some of mine and will be adjusting them but, I am not sure it will be worth the time if they make other changes that so effect the way the game is played.

We'll see?



Ed