Bunkers

[Reddog]

I just finished playing the scenario called "Enemy at the Gate" and commanded the Axis side. I've yet to fight in a battle that had not only a large amount of "bunkers" but as the attacker I needed to capture at least 1 for any hopes of even accomplishing a "Draw".

I'm not the "sharpest knife in the drawer" nor anything above an average tactician but "bunkers" have got to be one of the hardest obstacles in these CS games to capture... prior to the introduction of rockets in the war.

Granted "bunkers" must have been a difficult defensive position to capture and/or destroy in the war but I think their defensive abilities in the CS games are far too strong in comparison to the attack values given the troops and equipment in the game. I can see the rifle squads or for that matter the PzG squads may not have the firepower in the early years of the war but I think the engineers and especially the flamethrower tanks should be able to do more damage to "bunkers" in the game then their current capabilities?

Maybe this is something that could be posted and/or discussed at the Matrix website under their current posting of "Wish List"? A consideration to either adjust the defensive value of "bunkers" and/or "pillboxes" and/or increase the attack value of engineers and/or flamethrower vehicles?

These are just my thoughts and I guess you could say tactical frustrations and I would like to know what your thoughts are? Your battlefield encounters with "bunkers" and how you approached and dealt with them... again this is prior to rocket launchers?

I don't mean to say that once the rocket launchers hit the battlefield that they are any easier to take out and/or capture but at least then you have a better chance of doing so... IMHO.

Thanks for your time and thoughts. :thumbs_up:

[Jason Petho]

http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65243

Hopefully that helps

Jason Petho

[Reddog]

Thanks Jason that does help. :thumbs_up:

I guess my problem is consistently really bad dice rolls and/or not getting my artillery close enough to make a difference. As mentioned in the above post and in that particular battle I could not disrupt the enemy troops within the bunker with my artillery. Using 105mm guns (size 3 & 4 units) 4 artillery guns, 150mm How (size 2 units) 2 artillery guns, 150mm inf guns (size 2 units) 3 artillery guns.

The 1 bunker I did take I was lucky enough to isolate a mg & 45 AT gun in the bunker. I couldn't disrupt them so I took a chance and assaulted the bunker with 3 engineer and 2 PzG squads and took it.

[Mike Abberton]

It also depends on what game you are talking about. East Front bunkers are different than West Front/Rising Sun bunkers (which I think are the same).

One note on artillery and bunker busting. If the defender stacks the bunker with six, high defense, 2-SP units (especially ones with high attack factors like German MG squads) artillery loses much of its effectiveness. That's because artillery is less effective on low-sp infantry units than on high-sp units, and with six 2-sp units he still only has 12 sp in the hex total. If that is the case, don't rely on your artillery alone to disrupt all 6 units prior to the assault. It'll take a lot of direct fire units as well (assault guns, Sherman 105s, SU-152s, or other big HE throwers if you have them).

Strangely enough, late war if you have some high-hard attack factor tanks (Tigers, Fireflys, etc.), pillboxes (hard targets) can actually be easier to take out than bunkers (soft targets), although artillery doesn't do much against pillboxes.

[Krec]

i try and just stay away from bunkers, more times then not they take too long to clear. you need alot of time to clear. You are better off passing them. This is not always pssible , in which case pound the hell outta them with arty ,planes,spguns are best what ever it takes to disrupt.

[Copper]

I suggest surrounding the bunker to knock it out of supply and prevent reinforcements, then using high assault INF units (ENGs, Soviet SMGs, Soviet MC squads)with a leader will sometimes give you a little surprise on the bunker ownership.. even if the units inside are not disrupted :)

Also, do not attempt assaults with out of supply units, they attack on 3/4 their power.

[Reddog]

Thanks Comrades Panther Bait & Dev. You've both made some excellent points with sound tactical plans of attack that I'll most certainly check out. :thumbs_up:

But then as Comrade Krec has so wisely mentioned "just stay away from bunkers" is what I also prefer if at all possible. ;)

[Krec]

Great point Red Devil, you are correct. If you have time your surrounding tactic is best. Thats brings up another great feature ....the out of supply unit. Sometimes i am getting ready to spring ahead with the tip of the spear only to relize.........my forward units are ......OUT OF SUPPLY.......not now i say , bastards can really piss me off. lol , great stuff!!

[Digger]

I always wondered why Bunkers in EF have 20 defence and bunkers in WF and RS have 10 defence.

Perhaps it is time just to make them all 10 in the Matrix editon, though it may change the balance of some scenarios.

Matt