SAM effectiveness

[General SP]

Perhaps I am mistaken in this but from all the pilots I have talked to pretty much have stated that if a SAM hits your plane then you are pretty much out of action.

For example: In a game Klanx and I are playing, I watched a fighter bomber get hit by 3 Sams and only take a total of 3 damage from all 3 Sams but the radar gun blasted it for 24. I realize that a plane could take light damage and still continue a mission, however not after 3 SAM hits.

So with that in mind I need information on what you think, heard, seen etc.....

[shortreengage]

Many SAMs use proximity warheads. Maybe the hits are just near misses that cause dammage.

[RedDevil]

Are you shooting real SAMs or those artificial ones with 50% less filling?

I whacked grumblers jet down with a SAM hit and even proceeded to drill it with Vulcans while it was on the way to the ground in a fiery fireball exhibit..


Now I'm not saying it was all the SAMs fault but for several turns now all my SAM sites have been pounded by 175mm artillery relentlessly :)

I was under the impression a SAM hit equaled a kill.. guess not then?

[Grumbler]

Dupuy (sp?) had an analysis in his book "Arab Israeli Wars" and found that it took about 70 SAM's to shoot down an IAF Jabo. The Numbers from Vietnam were just as bad (good?). I don't have the book handy but I think the Chinese should have done better, since they were using SA-2's and SA-3's for the most part. The Eqyptians used mostly SA-7's. The ManPADS have small warheads, less then a kilo in most cases. The process that goes on inside a Jet engine is much more powerful, destructive and HOTTER then anything a 1.8 pound warhead can produce. So the Strella would fly up the exhaust of the Jet and explode, doing no major damage to things designed to suffer MUCH worse in their normal usage then that small warhead was able to produce.
However, if a red light goes on in the cockpit, the jet goes home, which is a mission kill.
The bigger SAMs might have a 100 Kilo warhead, which is basically a large shotgun shell that used a proximity fuse to send out a cloud of projectiles. These are more then capable of blotting a jet fighter from the sky, IF they got close enough. Remember the early SAMs were not as agile nor a lot faster then the fighters. Nor very smart. They flew to a point in space and if they were close enough to what their radar said was a target, they would trigger the warhead. Avoid that point in space and or fool the radar and the missile would miss.
One of the most successful guided missiles was the 'sidewinder' series. IIRC about 1200 war shots produced over 100 kills. Most of the kills were against single engines jets.
Guided missiles are death to helios. The small warhead is more effective against the small, less powerful jets in a helicopter. Maybe I'm pounding your Hawk batteries because I have a bunch of AH's waiting to swoop around your flank and slaughter you armor?

[General SP]

[retired from gaming]

[shortreengage]

Lets get it straight - there is no such thing in known world as SP engine for air combat.

But of course there is... A chart, some dice and an umpire You guys do remember what dice are right? I know Grummi does. He's got some pink fuzzy ones dangling off his rear view mirror.

[Greybeard]

Hello All,

I've given up on SAMS.. low ammo supply, one or two shots per OP fire phase.. then if you use them during your portion of the turn, ot's time to run back for more ammo..

I'll use radar AA anytime pver SAMS's

Greybeard

[General SP]

Hello All,

I've given up on SAMS.. low ammo supply, one or two shots per OP fire phase.. then if you use them during your portion of the turn, ot's time to run back for more ammo..

I'll use radar AA anytime pver SAMS's

Greybeard

Perhaps that is the best way to go about it Steve. I will have to experiment with the radar guns next. Here is a chart from the Shrapnel community with SAMs listed and there warhead sizes/penetration etc from each country although I could not find the Patriot on it.

[Grumbler]