Speed in Meeting Engagements

Der Kuenstler · 11-24-2006, 02:45 AM,

Happy Thanksgiving, everyone! While waiting for the turkey to finish I thought it would be interesting to start a thread about speed in meeting engagements.

The meeting engagement is one of the most popular battles played here. Some dislike playing them because of the obligatory race to the flags. Well, if you are forced into a race you might as well win that race! The reason is that the moment you park your boys around those flags, and your opponent realizes he is late getting there, the battle has now become an attack QB with you as defender. His problem is that he has no bonus units to get you out of there as in a regular attack QB - the points are even!

The key is speed. How do you get your units there faster than him? The fastest way is riding on a vehicle down a road. Pick your speed lanes - a straight road is faster than a curved one. Paved is faster than dirt. The fewer waypoints you use the better - it cuts down on time delay.

Lately, I've been trying out crack trucks. What a waste of points, you say! Yes - they cost extra but think about it - if you need to get there quick a green truck will start moving in 21 seconds. A crack truck will move in 7 seconds. Thats not counting waypoints you will need - a crack truck only adds a second delay per waypoint. Green 3 or 4+. Plus, crack vehicles will bog less and stay on task better despite small arms fire, saving you more time. In one of my QBs, I used crack trucks with a vet recon team and was downtown so fast, I had time for Christmas window shopping before his first units showed up. I could have had them on the main flag in cover IN THE FIRST MINUTE if I had had the foresight to give them disembark orders. Now look - you've got an ambush situation set up because he doesn't expect you to get there that fast. (get the trucks out of sight when they've done the job)

When on foot, the first minute everybody whose speed is "fast" runs. Just make a long run line through as clear of terrain as you can find - no extra waypoints - they add time. (Of course use some sense - when possible stay in the low areas out of obvious sight.) Running up a hiil will slow and tire the men quicker. The more cover you go through, the slower and more tired you will be. In the first turn, don't send your boys crashing through a bunch of woods. Run them over open ground, down a road is even better - the enemy can't see you well the first minute anyway. Think track meet - smooth surfaces. When setting up - and you have the option to set up in front of rocky or clear ground -choose clear -it's a realistic game - which would YOU rather run through? Ever turn an ankle on a rock? The second minute you will see most of your boys show "tiring" - change their orders to "move" now. You don't want them tired - that will slow them down. Be more careful "move to contact" as you get closer to the flag. Even when in the firezone - don't be afraid to run say - 20 meters or less - instead of advancing - to get to some good cover. You'll find that a lot of the time when you are running a short distance he won't have time to aim at you or will only get one shot off and miss.

A note on disembarking - there is a faster way. Use only one waypoint - into the nearest cover - on run. As long as your first waypoint is within 30 meters or so of the truck, they'll hit the ground running. That works for towed guns too. Many players hit the first waypoint right by the vehicle, sometimes to the back of the vehicle. Watch what happens - the guys jump off and run backwards, turn around, then run to the second waypoint. You've just lost a few precious seconds there.

When starting off with a towed gun or HMGs or whatever on your truck, you must go farther than 30 meters before the first stop! If you go less than 30 meters, thinking you'll stop at that nice heavy tree clump up there, the gun crew will just unload at the start line and push the gun up to where you wanted the truck to stop, costing you precious time and exposing the slow gun to fire.

Another way to beat your opponent to the flags is to slow him down. Set up some of your HMGs, FOs, and infantry guns to cover his likely approach lanes. 75mm is good for this because it's cheap to buy and comes down fast. MGs won't hurt him much from that far away but they will make him stop and perhaps duck - that's all the extra time you need if you are running.

Another thing - if there is a flag out there that is placed to his advantage - let him have it. You don't need all of the flags- only most of them - to win. If he has paved roads to it in cover and you have to run through swampland, forget it. Let him have that one and pound it with your artillery later.

It's true that someone will say- "Let him have the flags - I'll just pound it with artillery." I'm just talking about getting a light recon force in there first - you can't afford trucks for everybody anyway - bring your heavier stuff up later.

That's all I can think of for now - anybody else have a speed tip?

11-24-2006, 06:17 AM,

Gentlemen, I give you examples from the masters of the QB engagement, read and realise why wasting money on trucks is just not an option.

http://www.fewgoodmen.co.uk/forum/viewfo...5175418216

Dobie · 11-24-2006, 07:28 AM,

Nice read DK. Seeing how we just started a ME, is this a red herring or should I be taking notes? Either way guess I'll find out.

Soldier · 11-24-2006, 08:56 AM,

There's one downfall to the "get to the flags first" ideology though.
Providing your opponent has equipped himself with a high caliber off board artillery, your arse is grass..
Lets say 120mm cal and higher.
He'll drop it on your occupiers of the flag/flags in the last few turns of the said scenario and than bonsai his infantry over your demoralized survives, etc..
That' all she wrote, for you my friend.. :-)

McIvan · 11-24-2006, 09:53 AM,

Thats why you put only a few troops on the actual objectives, and the rest on terrain nearby that covers the approaches to the objectives. Meanwhile, you use YOUR artillery to wipe out enemy forming up for the assault that they're planning to do under cover of THEIR artillery. And if you don't have any such artillery, well, presumably you spent your points wisely on something else that can be put to good use.

It's always better to have the flags.

11-24-2006, 12:02 PM,

Trucks are a waste of money IMHO. The only way to get troops to the flag is on the back of tanks (that's if you really think ME's are about getting to the flag first... they aren't... it's all about tactics, kit picks and using your terrain).

For the 4 crack trucks you would buy to get your platoon to the flag, I'd spend that same amount of points on an arty spotter to drop a few hundred pounds of high explosive on you when you got there and then take the flag from you once your troops have been pounded into the earth.

There are some "playful" tactics that some people use, like buying one truck and a couple of FT's or TH's to race to the flag, hide and wait for your opponent to do the same with his tanks. But no serious player in his right mind would drive tanks up to a flag that has no LOS to the enemies approach and a good road network. That's what scouts are for. It will only work on unexperienced players.

These are just my opinions from game experience and shouldn't be viewed as gospel. Everyone should throw in their two cents for a thorough examination of the subject.

Cheers!

Leto

Ratzki · 11-24-2006, 12:28 PM,

Quote:Trucks are a waste of money IMHO. The only way to get troops to the flag is on the back of tanks (that's if you really think ME's are about getting to the flag first... they aren't... it's all about tactics, kit picks and using your terrain).

I agree, too much of a terrain crap shoot to buy trucks, and with the random maps you get with QB's more often then not they are a waste. I like it when my opponent gets to the flag first, at least I know where he is. I try(note the word try) to time my advance to the flags to end with the last turns of the game, taking into consideration time for attacking, that way there is little time to counter attack. If you can take care of your enemy along the way to the flags, the flags will sort of take care of themselves.

Quote:ME's are about getting to the flag first... they aren't... it's all about tactics

Again, I agree, while you rush to take the flags and then set up to cover the advances to those flags the other guy will slowly advance in strength to the flags with good cover and smoke then take the flags in strength with his own covering fire to stop you from reinforcing the flag that you got to first. Then as he is there in good form and has worked you over some, you have too little time to counterattack. If you rush there in force all the more easier to blast you with arty, if you just use a light force, then you are easy to dig out of your positions, and are overpowered in the numbers game. Rush away, I'll take on that tactic any time. Now and then the map comes up where that is your only option, but I don't feel that is the norm.

Der Kuenstler · 11-24-2006, 01:15 PM,

11-24-2006, 01:36 PM,

I don't use tank riders to get to flags for the very reason you mention.

I guess we agree to disagree on this (ie trucks being a good idea to gain first foothold of a flag). I could find a million uses for that extra 110 points that would make you pay for your purchase every time. In terms of giving advice to my opponents, I dearly hope they listen to you.

; )

BTW, I wouldn't paraphrase McIvan out of context to bolster your own theories. Re read his statement. It says nothing about using speed, trucks or even wing-ED pegasii to race to the flag.

What you propose is "A" strategy. It is not necessarily a good one IMHO. Much like a lot (make that "majority") of the strategy posts I make, including the one herein.

That's the beautiful thing about these boards... tactics are dynamic and subjective and we can choose to use, ignore, or debate such points. I think all three are useful.

But you are right, this board is dying in terms of useful posts. Kudos for starting one of the better threads here for the last month.

Cheers!

Leto

Der Kuenstler · 11-24-2006, 03:07 PM,

Thanks Leto. I only mentioned McIvan in that he agrees it's good to get there first - I didn't mean to imply that trucks are the way he would do it.

Specifically, just to avoid the very pitfalls you mentioned - I would use trucks on a straight road that entered a city with pavement, where the main flag is in a heavy building - then the advance platoon could run in the building while the trucks could have the cover of the building to back away. If done quickly your opponent might never even know you were in there. But you're right - trucks wouldn't work in many other situations.

I have been reading the posts on the FraGMent site Geordie listed for the past couple of weeks and he is right - there are a lot of great players there sharing valuable game tips.