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Bolt out of the Blue 5.3
08-20-2013, 08:57 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-20-2013, 09:00 PM by Elxaime.)
#56
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0
(08-20-2013, 08:05 PM)tazaaron Wrote:
(08-20-2013, 08:01 PM)JDR Dragoon Wrote: The solution to the 34 Artillery division problem is simple: Make the Special Grouping Berlin subordinate to HQ GSFG. It will not really affect playability (the Special Grouping HQ is an army HQ, HQ GSFG is a Front HQ) and the 34 Artillery Division (a unit directly under GSFG) will now fire in support of the Special Grouping (but not the Motschützendivision 1, since this belongs to an Army subordinate to another Front, but you can of course change this after the first 24 hours and assign it to the Special Grouping as well).

The rest of my comments is about to be written up, but to appease my employer I have to work on work-related military history rather than game-related military history for the time.

It was simple, i deleted the berlin option, took 12.2 seconds

While a simpler fix, I am wondering if deletion of the Berlin option for 34th Artillery Division is best. From what I can tell, with the Trench factor now fifty percent, Berlin is a much tougher nut to crack. Unless the Pact chooses the Operation Zentrum reinforcement of an elite GDR Motorized Division, I suspect the Pact forces in place cannot take it. And if a commitment was made of a division, it is just as easy to see the Pact high command also committing the artillery.

I understand the military logic that a Soviet heavy artillery division would be used at the main front. But I think the political logic is as compelling. If the Warsaw Pact were to have attacked NATO, a key and early sign of success - and perhaps a necessary morale booster for wavering Pact allies - would have been the decisive and early conquest of Berlin. The fall of the historic and symbolic capital of Greater Germany would have immense propaganda value. Conversely, a NATO garrison stubbornly persisting in Berlin for days or even weeks would have been a propaganda disaster. The Fall of Berlin in 1945 has a mythic place in Soviet history. One can even seen unrest among generals in the Soviet Army itself if it is not made a major early objective.

Not sure if this can be done under the engine, but perhaps a way forward is to keep both options, make the command re-arrangements described above, and have a victory point cost to the Pact for NOT taking the Operation Zentrum and 34th Artillery options. This would allow the Pact to choose to ignore Berlin in the short term, at a political cost - a reasonable outcome.
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Messages In This Thread
Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 07-13-2013, 03:15 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Strela - 07-14-2013, 12:59 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-14-2013, 01:53 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Strela - 07-14-2013, 04:00 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-14-2013, 04:10 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Strela - 07-15-2013, 05:38 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-15-2013, 05:47 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Elxaime - 07-16-2013, 07:14 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Taffy6 - 07-16-2013, 01:14 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Taffy6 - 07-16-2013, 01:32 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-16-2013, 02:22 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Taffy6 - 07-17-2013, 05:35 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-17-2013, 05:59 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Taffy6 - 07-17-2013, 10:12 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-18-2013, 05:56 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by tbridges - 07-19-2013, 07:45 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-19-2013, 08:00 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by tbridges - 07-19-2013, 08:28 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-19-2013, 09:54 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Taffy6 - 07-19-2013, 01:54 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by tbridges - 07-20-2013, 12:39 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Taffy6 - 07-20-2013, 02:38 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by tbridges - 07-20-2013, 05:33 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-20-2013, 05:39 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by tbridges - 07-20-2013, 06:06 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-20-2013, 06:28 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by tbridges - 07-20-2013, 06:48 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by Aaron - 07-20-2013, 06:57 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 - by tbridges - 07-20-2013, 07:42 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 Beta is up - by Aaron - 07-25-2013, 12:13 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 Beta is up - by tbridges - 07-25-2013, 11:55 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 Beta is up - by Aaron - 07-27-2013, 02:07 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 Beta is up - by Aaron - 07-29-2013, 10:34 AM
RE: Bolt 5.0 Beta2 - by The Teacher - 08-04-2013, 08:05 PM
RE: Bolt 5.0 Beta2 - by Aaron - 08-04-2013, 10:18 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-09-2013, 04:49 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 08-10-2013, 12:27 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-10-2013, 02:24 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 08-11-2013, 07:26 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-11-2013, 08:48 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-16-2013, 06:30 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Midge - 08-18-2013, 01:24 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-19-2013, 02:48 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 08-20-2013, 12:38 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Midge - 08-20-2013, 01:09 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-20-2013, 02:40 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 08-20-2013, 03:38 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-20-2013, 04:04 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-20-2013, 10:18 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by CarnageINC - 08-20-2013, 10:36 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-20-2013, 11:05 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by CarnageINC - 08-20-2013, 02:22 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-20-2013, 03:23 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by JDR Dragoon - 08-20-2013, 08:01 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-20-2013, 08:05 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 08-20-2013, 08:57 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-20-2013, 09:08 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Midge - 08-21-2013, 01:48 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 08-21-2013, 04:12 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-21-2013, 04:33 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 08-21-2013, 05:13 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-21-2013, 05:23 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by CarnageINC - 08-21-2013, 12:49 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-21-2013, 03:41 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 08-24-2013, 10:42 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 08-25-2013, 05:29 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 09-11-2013, 03:16 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Cassanos - 09-26-2013, 12:17 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 09-26-2013, 01:54 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 09-11-2013, 02:05 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 09-11-2013, 09:11 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 09-17-2013, 09:48 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 09-18-2013, 01:04 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 09-26-2013, 04:57 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by tbridges - 09-26-2013, 08:00 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 09-26-2013, 11:42 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Elxaime - 10-03-2013, 02:38 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.0 - by Aaron - 10-03-2013, 08:18 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 10-06-2013, 05:34 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by tbridges - 10-06-2013, 05:54 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 10-06-2013, 08:43 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 10-15-2013, 12:09 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 10-15-2013, 03:00 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 10-15-2013, 03:12 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 10-16-2013, 12:20 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 10-16-2013, 11:17 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Midge - 10-23-2013, 02:08 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Witblitz - 11-19-2013, 02:45 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 11-20-2013, 01:25 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 11-20-2013, 10:22 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 11-21-2013, 03:53 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Ricky B - 11-20-2013, 01:52 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 11-20-2013, 03:33 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 11-20-2013, 03:55 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 11-21-2013, 02:23 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 11-26-2013, 08:03 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 11-26-2013, 09:08 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 11-26-2013, 09:35 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by tbridges - 12-18-2013, 09:15 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 12-19-2013, 09:48 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by tbridges - 12-19-2013, 09:51 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 12-20-2013, 12:44 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 12-20-2013, 01:33 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Elxaime - 12-20-2013, 07:22 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 12-20-2013, 09:45 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by Aaron - 01-05-2014, 05:32 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.1 - by tbridges - 01-06-2014, 01:51 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.2 - by Aaron - 01-07-2014, 02:04 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.2 - by Aaron - 01-08-2014, 10:00 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.2 - by Elxaime - 01-08-2014, 11:59 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.2 - by Aaron - 01-10-2014, 10:52 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 02-23-2014, 03:36 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Elxaime - 02-24-2014, 06:24 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 02-24-2014, 07:16 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Elxaime - 02-24-2014, 10:27 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 02-25-2014, 12:30 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by tbridges - 02-25-2014, 01:16 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 02-25-2014, 03:16 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Elxaime - 02-25-2014, 11:15 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 02-26-2014, 04:34 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Elxaime - 02-26-2014, 11:19 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 02-26-2014, 11:43 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Elxaime - 02-26-2014, 01:26 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 02-26-2014, 01:48 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aolain - 03-11-2014, 02:27 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 03-11-2014, 11:50 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aolain - 03-12-2014, 12:44 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 03-12-2014, 07:39 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Ricky B - 03-12-2014, 03:48 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Cassanos - 07-20-2014, 03:47 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by KAreil - 07-28-2014, 02:10 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Compass Rose - 07-28-2014, 02:54 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 07-28-2014, 04:04 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Cassanos - 07-30-2014, 11:02 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 08-03-2014, 11:26 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Beachinnole - 06-14-2016, 11:02 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Strela - 06-17-2016, 11:17 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 07-16-2016, 04:08 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by a173192 - 09-30-2016, 04:36 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Dodo98 - 10-13-2016, 11:48 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Strela - 10-14-2016, 05:52 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Aaron - 12-10-2017, 03:56 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Lohengrin - 04-22-2018, 05:51 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Strela - 04-22-2018, 11:43 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Lohengrin - 04-24-2018, 11:49 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Strela - 04-24-2018, 01:54 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Lohengrin - 04-26-2018, 02:17 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Lohengrin - 04-26-2018, 05:30 AM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Lohengrin - 04-27-2018, 10:27 PM
RE: Bolt out of the Blue 5.3 - by Lohengrin - 04-28-2018, 10:46 PM

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