Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Printable Version

Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Printable Version

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Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Warhorse - 09-26-2012

Hey folks,

It has come to my attention through H2H playtesting that it is thought the Human Wave feature is broken, and should be removed. However, this is a ton of work, and I fear that hardly anyone is playing this now anyway. I'm going to do this by poll responses, so if you have this game, and don't like the Human Wave feature, voice your opinion now. If the evidence is overwhelmingly in favor of 86'ing it, I'll go ahead and take the plunge. This however requires moving the PLA to a new country slot, changing the exe's, the platoon and all formation files, all scenario's, and all related graphics renamed/numbered, as well as weapon and main PDT and unittxt/pics files!!!

Speak now, or forever hold your peace!! Helmet Wink

RE: Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - K K Rossokolski - 09-26-2012

Why bother? A lot of work for little purpose IMO.
LEAVE IT IN, I say.

Why is it broken? Are there criteria that indicate so? What does the history tell us about the effectiveness of this tactic?
If there is evidence that the human wave attack is out of whack with historical reality, are there other ways to adjust?
If so, possibilities could include:
a. decreasing defence value of some PLA troops such as line infantry;
b. increasing soft attack value of UN troops especially MGs and in particular .50cal*
c. increasing vulnerability of PLA leaders*,

AND REMEMBER THE BOTTOM LINE...HUMAN WAVE IS NOT COMPULSORY. It could very easily be the subject of personally agreed ROE between players.

If, Mike, as you say sadly, there are any.

* I have long believed that across the whole of CS the .50" cal is too weak against infantry, and that leaders are too hard to kill.

RE: Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Larry Reese - 09-26-2012

Exactly, if players don't like it, agree not to use it before hand.

LR

RE: Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Warhorse - 09-26-2012

So far, my sentiments exactly, appreciate the feedback! Just thought maybe I was wrong, and would change it if everyone thought that way.

RE: Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Ashcloud - 09-26-2012

(09-26-2012, 08:16 AM)K K Rossokolski Wrote: * I have long believed that across the whole of CS the .50" cal is too weak against infantry, and that leaders are too hard to kill.

Agree

RE: Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Big Ivan - 09-26-2012

Hey Mike,

I haven't tried HW yet in a scenario but based on the above feedback leave the feature in. Taking it out looks like a lot of work with a long payback.

I will try HW though and give you my opinion.

John

RE: Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Crossroads - 09-26-2012

(09-26-2012, 06:24 PM)Ivan The Big Wrote: I haven't tried HW yet in a scenario but based on the above feedback leave the feature in. Taking it out looks like a lot of work with a long payback.

RE: Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - David Galster - 09-30-2012

Gentlemen,

The extreme assault option is a counter to the Human Wave tactic. Players have the option to toggle EA on if they agree to use the Human Wave.

If Banzai assaults are acceptable in Rising Sun, shouldn't Human Wave attacks be as well, assuming the the design is the same?

Thanks,

David Galster

RE: Korean War- Human Wave too strong? - Kool Kat - 09-30-2012

(09-30-2012, 12:48 AM)David Galster Wrote: If Banzai assaults are acceptable in Rising Sun, shouldn't Human Wave attacks be as well, assuming the the design is the same?

David:

I would state that Banzai assaults are built into Rising Sun, but IMO these "tactics" are not "acceptable" both in the way Banzai is implemented or historical. Fiery

Historically, Banzai assaults were suicidal, last ditch charges by trapped and cut off Japanese troops... in which most of the charging Japanese were killed... and not a calculated "tactic" that commanders could initiate on the battlefield as a repeatable strategy. That the game engine allows the same Japanese troops to initiate Banzai multiple times during an engagement... is fantasy.

As a designer, I don't allow Banzai to be used in my scenarios. I also don't play RS scenarios using Banzai either.

IMO, keep the Human Wave in the Korean Mod. Players and designers have the option to either allow it or not? Idea2