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One generally successful tactic to use when playing human opponents in CM is to keep moving. The reason is that good players will react in some way to everything your units do on the battlefield. They will either begin to move something over to destroy what they’ve spotted, move something out of imminent danger, or sit tight and observe, waiting for ideal killing conditions.

AT Guns - when you’ve fired off that hidden gun and you have killed your target, and you are not getting any return fire, move that gun quickly. You’ve been spotted now and it will only be a matter of minutes before HE starts falling on your gun. Move the gun and a) you will get to fire it again from another place and b) he will waste a few rounds of HE on an empty spot when he gets it into position. During one QB I was able to move my 57mm gun three times - I know he was thinking “how did he afford all those things?” but it was the same gun!

Infantry - cycle through them every turn and ask “Is this the best cover for these guys?” On the flag is not the best place for them. Can you get them in front of the flag? That way when your opponent is stopped by your fire he is not able to neutralize it -he won’t be close enough. Keep an eye out for large caliber spotting rounds. Get your men out of there when one falls. When you meet a lot of resistance, pull back and go around or wait for more help. Walk a platoon around behind the lines - see what they run into - I’ve killed a lot of FOs that way. *Note - once your infantry are in good cover and unspotted you DO NOT want to keep moving them as they will spot and shoot better when still.

Armor - there is not a safe place for armor on the battlefield if it’s left there sitting long enough - not without a good infantry screen around it. If you are aware of an enemy platoon in the area and it disappears for a while - then get that armor the heck out of there - assume he’s sneaking them up on you - he probably is. If you win a short armor clash, back out and move. He will likely move more armor over there - don’t be there when he gets there. Take advantage of his moves with your own. For example, if you spot him area firing a building with a tank, make your move on that tank then - while it is distracted with an order. In town you can also distract tanks by running AT teams behind them - the AI will turn their turrets all the way around to shoot the team. Now make your move. Then move out of there before he reacts to what you’ve done.

Halftracks- I’m still trying to learn how to keep these things alive. They make excellent tank bait, I know that. Don’t leave them sitting around parked for long in view of the enemy - even on overwatch - is all I can say.

Trucks - once they’ve done their job, get them quickly the heck out of there, preferably off the map.

Crews - don’t be lazy with them any leave them sneaking across open ground after their tank is taken out - get them to cover immediately with a “withdraw” order - your opponent gets big points for killing them.

FOs - they are worth BIG points - there’s really no reason I can think of to leave them exposed to roving squads after they’ve fired off their rounds - get them out of there - even all the way off the map - that way they can’t be shot or taken prisoner.

Schrek teams and snipers - can be moved successfully around the battlefield by using “fast” for short bursts in the open and then “move to contact and hide” in the trees. I like to do it that way - I don’t want my specialty guys firing at inopportune times and giving themselves away too early.

Mortars with spent ammo - again - why leave them sitting around to be shot at? Move them out of there.


In summary: assume that your opponent loves to win as much as you do and has a plan to destroy everything he has spotted, and if you leave your unit there long enough he will come get it. So you must foil those plans by continuing to be somewhere else. It takes more work to do all of this but it usually pays off in the win column.

Good post. I would re-emphasize the "move your armor" point.

Der Kuenstler Wrote:Keep moving tip - always set 2 or three waypoints ahead of your movers - the time delay will count down as they are moving, thus making a smooth move. Don’t wait until they come to a stop to give new orders - then they’ll sit there waiting.

However, I dont think that this is true. I am pretty sure the delay starts with the current order stops.

I am sure that you are right Col. T., the time starts after the last waypoint is reached for one move order.
I will add that you should assign more then the number of waypoints needed to get to where you are going. By doing this you open up more options when you do make contact with the enemy. You can stretch out waypoints, change directions and/or change movement types on the fly, instead of having to issue more move orders and suffer more delays. I would rather have my longer delay used in relative safety by assigning extra move waypoints, then have to issue just one waypoint order delay under heavy fire.
Also, be aware that you are walking a fine line with moving your infantry, as they are most vulnerable while moving. You do have to move but you can't push them too much. If you come under heavy fire, don't be afraid to cancel the orders and hope that the enemy will take on another moving target. You will, by alternating move orders, be suprised how much enemy fire a platoon can take and still gain ground.
Good topic DK.

Colonel Talvela Wrote:However, I dont think that this is true. I am pretty sure the delay starts with the current order stops.

You are right, CT and Ratsky - I tested this in the editor today - it is the same for vehicles and infantry - the delay starts counting down AFTER the current movement stops - thanks for the correction, guys. I deleted that part of the post and apologize for the misinformation...

However, wouldn't it still save some time to keep waypoints ahead of the unit moving? Say the unit ends his last movement 20 seconds into the movie phase - he would then lose the next 40 seconds waiting until the end of the movie for you to give him new orders. With new orders already in place his command delay clock would already be counting down.

In a multiple order path the delay in begining the next leg of the path is minimal once it has started. I believe due simply to the unit rotating to line up with the next leg. If you take a truck and plot out a path to follow a winding road it takes longer to start off if you add lots of way points on the turns, but it will travel it faster because it doesn't have to rotate as far to start each leg. that is part of why the computer comes up with those insanely waypoint overloaded routes when it plots a path around an obsticle. It is trying to save time on rotating.
It is fastest to plot out a waypoint path all the way to where you want it go, though the delay to start will be long. Each leg of a new path (that is movement added after the current path ending red box) adds a set number of seconds something like 10 for green, 7 for reg, 5 for vet (numbers may be wrong). however you can edit the next path at anytime and in anyway until the unit reaches the red box at the end of its currents path. The delay count doesn't start until you reach the red box.

Der Kuenstler Wrote:However, wouldn't it still save some time to keep waypoints ahead of the unit moving? Say the unit ends his last movement 20 seconds into the movie phase - he would then lose the next 40 seconds waiting until the end of the movie for you to give him new orders. With new orders already in place his command delay clock would already be counting down.

This is definitely a good idea.

Quote: will add that you should assign more then the number of waypoints needed to get to where you are going.

Likewise, it has been argued that you should never use the Pause command. Just add some extra waypoints, which you can always adjust.

Der Kuenstler Wrote:Crews - don’t be lazy with them any leave them sneaking across open ground after their tank is taken out - get them to cover immediately with a “withdraw” order - your opponent gets big points for killing them.

Hi,

DK, i am surprised to hear that. I usually use them as scouting tasks or suicide missions to explore a risky area.
In other words, my crews often finish games as minced meat.
And you tell us they cost a lot of victory points ??? I used to think that when a tank was dead, all the victory points for it (including the crew) were gone to the opponent.
How do you know this rule and what is the proportion of point between the crew and the vehicule only.

Cheers.
Hubert

Colonel Talvela Wrote:Likewise, it has been argued that you should never use the Pause command. Just add some extra waypoints, which you can always adjust.

I generally only use the pause command when starting a vehicle column for road movement. If the more experienced tanks are in back, then they will try to start moving before the less experenced tanks in front (less command delay). I put pauses in to keep the traffic jams from starting. Is there a better way to do this?

jawsconan Wrote:[quote=Der Kuenstler]
And you tell us they cost a lot of victory points ??? I used to think that when a tank was dead, all the victory points for it (including the crew) were gone to the opponent.
How do you know this rule and what is the proportion of point between the crew and the vehicule only.

Cheers.
Hubert

I did some more testing, Hubert, and, amazingly, you are both wrong and right. Here is my test:

I made a tiny scenario in the editor. I put a regular PzIVG out in the open presenting his side to a 57mm AT Gun hidden in some nearby woods. Accompanying the AT gun are two maxims and and SG43 mmg with short cover arcs. (I put a couple of German bunkers out of the action so the scenario wouldn't end as soon as the tank died.)

I then killed the tank several times and called a ceasefire, looking at the final results score each time.

When all five of the crew get out alive, the final score for the Allies is 140 (the exact cost of this tank in the editor without rarity)

I then ran the test again and when all five crew got out alive, I took the cover arcs off the mgs and machinegunned them all. After ceasefire the final score was 172 - that's 32 more points. Now imagine if your opponent was ruthless and took the time to hunt down and kill every crewmember you had on the field - in a big battle that could easily approach the cost of a 300 point flag.

In another test when only two crewmembers crawled out alive, the final ceasefire score was 159 - so the Russkies got 19 points because the other three German crewmembers burned up in the tank.

When two crewmembers died in the tank and three crawled out, the Russkies got 153 points, or 13 extra points for that. So the computer is definitely keeping track of each crewmember - although it seems to be a strange number of points (6.5 per man?) - not sure about that. This is a regular crew - I'm assuming vet and crack crews would garner even more points per man.

Here's the amazing thing - and proves that what you said is partly true: When the Russkies blew up the tank and instantly killed all the crew inside, and none crawled out, the final score went back to 140! So you actually get more points for letting the crew crawl out and shooting them than blowing the whole tank up!

dk, you ought to post this crew test you did in a new thread. that is good info